Yes, Bobby Miller had a bad 2024, and has not exactly started 2025 the way either LAD or himself were hoping for. His trade value is negligible right now. Some fans believe the Dodgers held on to Miller too long. While I concur that his trade value is marginal at best, I do not think the Dodgers had an opportunity to max out on his value. They were not going to trade him after his 2023 season. He was hurt in 2024 too much of the year so that teams were not eager to trade for him and give the Dodgers what they may have wanted.
IMO, the best thing to do with Miller is to keep pitching him. He is up to 91 pitches, which was just a tick above 18 pitches/inning. In the PCL, that may not be something to get overly excited about, but it really is not that bad. Early April and Miller reached 91 pitches? This is the time of year that Miller is sitting due to shoulder fatigue, so it is positive that he is pitching.
I have read from some critics that the Dodgers should have traded Miller after 2023. After 2023, the Dodgers did not have a veteran SP they could count on. Kershaw just had shoulder surgery and was not going to be ready until later in the season. They did not know whether Walker Buehler could make it back. Both Dustin May and Tony Gonsolin were not going to be available until July at the earliest for May, and maybe not at all for Gonsolin.
The Dodgers decided to trade one of the kids (Ryan Pepiot) to get a veteran pitcher with huge upside and significant health risk…Tyler Glasnow. They signed Yoshinobu Yamamoto to a $325MM deal believing that he could effectively transition to MLB, but not knowing. They signed James Paxton believing he could eat innings.
With what they had, I think they went into ST believing that Miller and Emmet Sheehan were going to be #4 or #5, with Gavin Stone available. Why would the Dodgers trade Miller with all of the questions they had, and acknowledging that Miller was pretty darn good as a Rookie in 2023?
Too answer the question, IMO, the Dodgers have not held onto Bobby Miller too long. There is no urgency to trade him.
Diego Cartaya is/was a different situation. For several years, the Dodgers already had Will Smith in LA, and Will was quickly becoming a fixture behind the dish. Dalton Rushing was just drafted in 2022. They might have traded Cartaya as they did Keibert Ruiz at the proverbial height of his trade value. AF/BG could have maxed his value after 2022. What might the Dodgers received in return for a package of Cartaya and Maddux Bruns after 2022? Instead they have probably lost any trade value for either player.
Jeren Kendall? Kody Hoese? Maddux Bruns? All first round picks who had trade value at some point. Kendall has retired. Hoese is coming to the end of his time in the Dodgers organization. He will become a free agent at the end of the year unless the Dodgers purchase his contract. Very doubtful? Bruns still has not even cracked the AA roster, and he is once again on the 60 day IL.
Did the Dodgers wait too long on Miguel Vargas? AF/BG believed in him, so I do not believe so. He was so productive in MiLB, but it just has not carried over to MLB. Maybe it still will, like it seemingly has for Keibert Ruiz. Vargas is still only 25 years old.
The Dodgers maxed the trade value for Alex Verdugo, Jeter Downs, and Connor Wong when they traded them for Mookie and David Price.
The Dodgers maxed out the value with Keibert Ruiz and Josiah Gray in the trade with Washington for Max Scherzer and Trea Turner.
It sure appears that the Dodgers may have maxed out their trade value with Michael Busch in the trade with the Cubs for Jackson Ferris and Zyhir Hope.
IMO, the biggest threat/risk to lose potential trade value is Dalton Rushing. He could be at the height of his trade value right now. He has no position with LAD in the near future. He is not going to start at catcher with Smith there. And the Dodgers did not commit $140MM to Smith so he could share the position. Dalton is not going to play 1B with Freddie. LF? Teoscar is in RF for 2025-2027. I am not confident that Rushing’s bat is better than Conforto’s. Next year?
There is little question that the Dodgers hold onto their top draft picks. Too long? Maybe, maybe not. It is hard to argue with the success of the Dodgers. Nevertheless it is still curious.
A look at another team for a different perspective.
Jarred Kelenic was a 1st round pick by NYM in 2018 (#6 overall). In December 2018, Seattle traded Kelenic and 4 other inauspicious players to NYM for Edwin Diaz and Robinson Cano. Kelenic reached Top 100 status in 2019, his 1st full year in professional baseball. NYM maxed out the trade value for Kelenic. Diaz has been an elite closer for several years. Certainly a better option than Kelenic.
While the jury is still out because Pete Crow-Armstrong still needs to prove he is a MLB player, NYM thought they maxed out their trade value for PCA. PCA was the Mets 2020 1st round pick (#19 overall). Although that 2021 trade did not work out nearly as well as the Kelenic trade. NYM was hoping for a much better Javy Baez. He started out well when he first joined the team. But that did not carry over to 2022 and beyond.
Prospects are suspects until proven.
I am still confident that Miller will turn around and play dividends with the Dodgers . Either on our roster or as a trade chip.Stuff is just too good.
His last outing was not good but as in his first start he showed what made him so good in 2023.
Bad loss again yesterday. Again the error bug bit the team.
Mookie IMHO is not SS on a championship team. First the fielding error and then the bad throw to home which should have easily gotten the runner. He just does not look comfortable there.
So many batting averages under the Mendoza line, some even under .100.
Will be interesting how long the Dodgers can carry on like that.
Go Dodgers!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
It’s early but eventually poor fielding catches up with you believe the hitting will come around eventually time perhaps to make some changes?
Yes, they are already happening.
Not worried about most of the bats on this team. But I think right now, the bench players are ill-equipped to handle the job. Kike should not be playing every day. If they wanted to beef up the defense, I would have Muncy at first and Kike or Taylor manning third. Changes will come if some of these guys do not start to produce. They always do, but it is way too early for any kind of knee-jerk move. Offense will be better when Freeman comes back. Then the first five in the order are lethal.
It was cold and damp in DC. I think the conditions had much to do with the shoddy play. I trust Mookie to make the right decision if he feels he cannot do the job every day, and I trust Doc and the coaching staff to talk to him and relay their feelings. Unlike us fans, Doc sees how Mookie prepares every single day. He knows the abilities of his players much better than we do. I would rather see stuff like this early, than during the playoffs.
Miller. I think it’s possible he gets it together. The Dodgers could use him, that’s for sure. They are already calling on their 4-A staff. That sure didn’t take long.
It’s been said before and I’ll say it again, this team needs to hit its way to a Division title. And having 5 guys in the box score OPS’n ,533 and under will likely not get it done. It’s way early, it’s cold and damp on the east coast, so maybe when they get home they can get it going.
My opinion – Edman looks like he can play center but middle infield needs help. You know what I would do. And teams are gonna run on us. Asking pitchers to help won’t work as they can’t hold runners like they usta could. Smith is having difficulty throwing and when he does throw accurately middle infielders aren’t helping much. Maybe it gets better when it warms up. Hope so.
I know it is early, but I’m seeing in Mookie at SS was what I feared seeing in Mookie at SS (no excuses Bear Please, it is what it is). Something has to give, the left side of the infield is in really a disaster, not to mention that the offense from Max is nearly non-existent. We could use a healthy Freddie back in there, even an unhealthy Freddie would be an upgrade on the offense.
If he can’t do the job in the eyes of his manager and the coaches, change will come. But it is up to them to make that decision not us fans. RF is not an option anymore. Second base is. He could probably play CF and has done so before. But that move is unlikely. I think, and have to believe, they are going to keep Mookie at SS for at least a third of the season before making any decisions.
Let me clue you in on something, I’m not making the decisions, I’m commenting on the decision that was made by management. I have an opinion not an edict that I am pronouncing. Move likely, who knows but I can damn well comment on it, just like you do all the time. Enuf with yourself, we all have opinions, you don’t have to remind us that we are just fans and do not make the decisions about players!
is every loss a bad loss?
when do the posts about grit, chemistry and body language start?
Start ‘em Bluto.
Well, I think the last two were bad losses. Both winnable. Maybe I will write a post on grit, chemistry and body language for you.
Please don’t!
as to the first point, I don’t think I’ve ever read about a “good loss”
I agree that when Miller’s trade value was at its highest we needed him too much to trade him. So we can only hope he turns things around so that he might be a valuable trade chip in the future. I still would rather keep Stone, Ryan and Ferris over Miller, long term.
I’d love to know what Rushing’s value is on the trade market because I think we need to plan for a new third baseman in the next year or two. I think that’s more important than finding a new center fielder because we could plug in a defense- first guy there if necessary. And I’m still not convinced that Freeland is going to be an answer, no matter where they would want to play him.
I still think Rushing could be trained for 3B….
A lot of catchers have made that transition.
And De Paula should get a first baseman’s glove…
What is this based on Duke?
Sincere question. Why do you think that Rushing can play 3B? He has never played there in his college or professional life. He is not great at picking behind the dish. He is not that good of a defensive 1B. He has a .976 fielding percentage with 5 errors in 210 chances.
Rushing’s value is in his ability to hit as a catcher. He is at the top of that prospect tree. Why try to make him something he is not?
I agree that De Paula should try and play 1B.
I don’t practice Santeria
I ain’t got no crystal ball
Santeria. Had to look it up.
“HOW ABOUT ASKING THE GROUNDS CREW TO FIX THE MOUND SO GLASNOW CAN SAFELY AND EFFECTIVELY PITCH” Ted this morning.
I thought the same thing. So did Joe and Eric, who said the Dodgers could request repairs. Maybe Dave figured it wouldn’t matter, it would turn to slop quickly.
The Dodgers are an OPS team. Get on and slug. Pitching, by early stats anyway, has been good, though Dodger starters are down the list in innings pitched. I said that was probably going to be the case and so far it is. At this level of play you just can’t give away runs the way the Dodgers are. Will there be an adjustment? The only gifted defensive player this team has at the moment is at AAA. And where to put him? I say again, put him at short. Third base? For better or worse it’s Muncy.
Score and score again. That is the formula.
I love how Johnny Gentle’s cultural references continue to miss, despite the best of efforts.
I bet you’ve heard of BOFA
Bank of America????
I would hope Miller could find it again. When he is right, he can be dominant. He showed that last season in his first start against the Cardinals. I went back and watched that game again. The next start, he couldn’t find the plate.
Did the Dodgers wait too long to trade Bobby Miller?
I guess that depends on what the return might have been.
In the right deal, sure, deal him. No reason to cling to Miller when young guys like Gavin Stone and Sheehan and Jackson Ferris were stepping up–and you were counting on scoring Sasaki too. And May and Gonsolin coming back from injury… Oh, and that Ohtani guy…
I wanted to deal Miller to the O’s or Yankees or ?? for premium position prospect in part because of the Dodgers pitching depth.
Yet now Snell is already hurt and both Knack and Wrobo have been summoned.
I expect Miller will get his turn too.
He was impressive as a rookie. He can still get it together.
Wrobo starts today’s game, Knack might be with the team, but no pitcher has been announced for tomorrow’s game which is on at 1:05 PST. Cubs at Dodger Stadium starting Friday. LA now in third place, .50 percentage points behind the Padres.
Isn’t that true for any player?
When do you think that Miller was worth a premium position prospect? And, what is your definition of a premium position player? 60 FV? 55? 50? The concensus view of 50 is that of an average MLB player. 55 is above average and 60 is All Star.
Coby Mayo is a 60 FV, and there is no way, Baltimore trades him for Bobby Miller. Baltimore also has a pair of 50 FV in Enrique Bradfield Jr. and Vance Honeycutt as their top OF prospects. Baltimore would not trade either one for Miller right now.
Does anyone really think NYY would trade Jasson Domiguez (60 FV), George Lombard Jr. (55 FV) or Spencer Jones (50 FV) for Miller?
The only time I can figure when Miller was worthy of a premium position player was after 2023. As I stated, IMO, the Dodgers were counting on needing Miller for 2024. Even with Glasnow and Yamamoto and Paxton, the Dodgers were planning on Miller and Sheehan to be the back of the rotation to start the season. Gavin Stone was still a relative unknown with poor 2023 numbers. He became a fixture in 2024 because Miller and Sheehan were not available.
No MLB team would give up a premium position player for Miller after last year.
The Dodgers did not acquire Jackson Ferris until January 2024. So he was not in the LAD plans at the time. Yes, he is now.
You are right, Miller is not now a necessity with Sheehan coming back this year, and Stone and Ryan next year. May and Gonsolin now. Wrobo, Knack, Frasso, and Ferris all MLB ready or very close (Ferris). So he is more than expendable prospect capital right now.
Here are the Dodgers position players with a FV of 50 or more:
Which of those players would you trade to get Bobby Miller. I would not trade any of the eight for Bobby Miller as he is now. But that is just my opinion. And maybe AF/BG sees it differently. But methinks if the Dodgers could have traded Miller for a premium position player, they would have done so.
Comets playing early today. Frasso is pitching. Kim is playing CF and leading off. Kim CF, Freeland SS, Rushing C, Rosario LF, Outman RF, Ward 1B, Chavis DH, Hoese 3B, Gauthier 2B.
Miller and Outman could be “change of scenery” bets. Both excelled in ’23, then slumped badly.
OK, here’s the deal: Miller + Outman for the O’s Cedric Mullins, a pending free agent.
A few years back, Mullins was a brighter star for the O’s but he’s been eclipsed by Gunner, Rutschman, Holliday and others. He’s a solid and sometimes spectacular CF who would enable Edman to play 2B.
Not a “wow” move, but Mullins could stabilize CF and be the “second leadoff” man.
Miller gets a pass this early in the season because of the line drive to his head.
Yes, last year was atrocious but he deserves a fresh start and starting it with a baseball to the dome ain’t it.
I agree with you that both Miller and Outman need a change of scenery. I do not think either one is in the LAD plans I would make that proposed trade. Would Baltimore? The trade simulator says that it is an overpay for LAD. Baltimore figures to stay in a pennant race all season, and Mullins is a stabilizing veteran for that team. Mullins is the current team leader in OPS (1.019) HR (3), RBI (12). He has a 14.0% BB rate and a 16.7% K rate. Mullins is a FA after this year, and Outman and Miller come with a lot of years of control. Miller might be a better option than Charlie Morton. Better than Dean Kremer or Cade Povich? Outman is not Cedric Mullins, so they would be taking a hit offensively. I just do not see Baltimore doing that deal unless they are out of the pennant race at the deadline.
FWIW, it is a good trade proposal, because I want to see both Outman and Miller with a new opportunity, and I have alsways like Cedric Mullins.
I’d be willing to add Hoese, Ward, Sauer and Garcia. Would that help?
It might help Baltimore say no
Mike Elias is ready to jump on that deal now!!!
*Too many middle infield bobbles for my money. Mookie got eaten up on a hard long hop, which was a hit, but he didn’t look particularly sharp on and the after Miggy’s missed backhand up the middle, he made a poor throw to the plate.
*Miggy looks to have a new glove that looks stiff. The backhand didn’t stay in the pocket.
*Both Mookie and Miggy can’t seem to pick a short-hop on steal attempts. Those are not great throws by Will but if you miss, you miss to the first base side with a short hop. But both guys look foreign to picking & tagging. They are both better than they played yesterday.
*Badger and I had this discussion awhile back; it looks like the Dodger pitchers make NO attempt to slide step, vary their moves, or quick pitch to hold runners. It looks like they just pitch and aren’t bothered by steals. Just out-slug the opposition and don’t worry about it. Will and Barnes have no shot most of the time.
* CT3 made a great throw to get a runner at 3rd.
*Kike is doing an admirable job at first, filling in for Freddie, but he ain’t Freddie. He made one play close on the ball by May, fielded by Miggy. Kike made it close by NOT stepping toward the throw on his stretch. He stepped one way and caught the throw the other way.
Just not clean defense.
*On the other side, DeJong and Alex Call looked like all-stars defensively.
*May got better as the game went on. He struggled through 3 and held the Nats to 3 runs. I was pleasantly surprised to see Doc live him in after his nice 5th inning and I’m glad he did. May had great last 3 innings with 9 up, 9 down. Nice to see.
I’m seeing a disturbing trend with Dodger pitching, including May early.
Most people claim that the best pitch in baseball is Strike One. My philosophy has always been a little different. While I value Strike One, to me the most IMPORTANT pitch is on one and one.
The reason is statically the difference between and 2 and 1 count and a 1 and 2 count is about 150 points in batting average. So I want to see the pitcher’s best pitch that day in 1 & 1 counts to get an out or get ahead. Especially the first time through. Yesterday May stayed with uncompetitive breaking balls and got too many two and one, disadvantage counts. He’s not alone, I see that way too much from the staff lately.
*Conversely, our guys are taking a lot of pitches in advantage counts. Betts, for example, took a half-ass slider down the middle on 2 &2 after Ohtani’s triple in the 5th go get to 3 & 2 where he hit a way tougher pitch ground ball the 3rd.
*Muncy missed a fat hanging slider in the 5th that screamed “Hit Me”. He struck out. In the bottom half, James Wood hit the identical pitch into the centerfield seats. Max did double later, finally going opposite.
*Welcome to the Show for this season, Hunter Fedducia. Nothing like getting to pinch hit in the 9th, as the tying run.
Nice to see hit get the opportunity.
Our bullpen is suddenly vulnerable.
Time to play better and we could use Freddie back.
Another good post Phil.
The idea behind strike one is of course to get ahead so you can aim for the edges. Interesting take on the 1-1. Sounds like coach speak, and I won’t disagree with it.
I’ve noticed the same thing on taking strikes. They take fastballs down the middle. I was taught, and I taught, look fastball adjust to breaking ball. Taking a fastball for a strike in a hitters count is a no no. And if you’re guessing curve and get a fastball you’re screwed.
I wonder if they can play better in inclement weather? Guess we’ll find out. Real feel at game time is said to be 37.
I was taught the same thing Badger. Look fastball and adjust to the breaking ball or change.
Too often TV folks give the impression that if a hitter isn’t guessing a certain pitch he can’t hit it. Some guy takes a fastball down the middle and the explanation was he was looking for something else. Drives me nuts.
Way too much guessing and not enough educated hitting.
Thank you!!
I think our guys are susceptible to poor play in cold and/or wet weather. After all, they’re SoCal guys and play their best in sunshine.
If it’s the post season, they can overcome their distaste for bad weather but early in the season, they’d rather be back in their hotel rooms with a good movie and a ribeye.
Mind you, I’m not complaining since they always do what they need to in order to make the playoffs.
Sauer optioned back to AAA, Wrobleski activated. Former Dodger, Octavio Dotel was killed when the roof of a club in Santo Domingo collapsed. Dotel was obtained in a trade with the Pirates in 2010.
Whoa, wasn’t expecting that
Wrobo being called up? Or Sauer optioned back to OKC.
The full Blake Snell experience:
We’re due the last one at some point this season
In most years, Snell’s year does not start until July.
March/April – 159.2 IP, 3.89 ERA
May – 165.1 IP, 4.57 ERA
June – 150.0 IP, 4.44 ERA
July – 189.0 IP, 2.43 ERA
August – 235.2 IP, 2.44 ERA
Sept/Oct – 206.0 IP, 2.14 ERA
I am okay if Snell takes a few starts off in the beginning of the season.
OutmanRF
500003.132.473
0-5 with 3 K’s today.
Feel terrible for the young man but what do you do with this?
be patient?
You’d make a great GM for the Angels
If make a great GM in fantasyland. That place alone.
Kim and Freeland, on the other hand, are threatening to replace someone on the 26.
I can think of more than one!
Yes they are.
He did hit a HR in his final AB.
Yeah, Blake has really been pretty consistent that way.
I’ll say the near no-hitter comes on August 17th.
Assuming he’s back on the active list by then, I’ve only got a 1 in 6 chance he even pitches that day.
Lineups are out. Ohtani DH, Betts SS, Edman 2B, Hernandez RF, Conforto LF, Kike 1B, Muncy 3B, Pages CF, Barnes C, Wrobleski P.
Looks like a lot of outs at the bottom of that lineup. Oh well, score 7 with the top of it.
O/U total runs 8.5. Cold weather should be low scoring, right? I’ll take the over (7-3) for 50 push-ups. Any takers?
No
How about 5 push-ups? You know you can use the work Bum.
Knees on ground?
Of course
Yeesh.
Unwatchable. So bad on every level. Wrobleski not ready for prime time. You can’t throw 92 without command
Patience!
The following is a 100% joke.
Perhaps we should also ask if the Dodgers held onto the following players too long:
Wrobo-Cop
Muncy
Taylor
Patience? As in wait til they get back to LA?
I got the over right.
As in wait till a month that starts with J at the earliest?
enjoy Spring?
Ok.
But does that mean you think the rest of April and all of May will look like this?
No, it means that I think nothing drives me more bonkers (bonkerser?) than early-season knee-jerk overreactions with regard to the best team in MLB.
I don’t see overreactions. I see observations.
Taylor yes, Muncy no. Wrobo too soon to say.
Another 4A pitcher tomorrow. Better score 8.
Seems to me we were having these conversations last year also, actually most years. “Better score 8” is the new Dodger early season mantra. Thank you Badger, it holds up well from season to season.
Reds shut out SF for the second night in a row and the Pads are down by a bunch to the A’s’ in the 9th.
And in case anyone was thinking we may have made a mistake in trading Lux, the current Reds cleanup hitter, he is hitting .225 with an OPS of .595. Something I believe Kim could have duplicated were he our current second baseman.
Should the dodgers go to a lineup like this with Freeman out take Betts out if shortstop and put him un rightfield tell him fucis on hitting the ball. Okay so you move Betts to right field Conforto to centerfield until trade deadline and teoscar to leftfield okay that outfield is set. Then in the infield put Kiki at third base and miggy ro at shortstop and edmans at second base and Muncy at first base and then Smith at catcher and see how that woekd dor a week okay cuz taylor can’t hit and Pages who know what he is doing okay these guys are way bettee then the Giants who are in first place now but the Betts at short has git to go he is an outfielder to many errors need guys that have played there. Okay.
They are not going to move Betts back to the outfield. Conforto hasn’t played CF since 2019 for a reason, he is not all that good out there. Kike isn’t hitting either. He has 4 hits this year, all homers. He might tighten the defense at third, but Muncy’s defense has not been the problem. Smith is the catcher, but to keep him fresh and healthy all season, he needs a day off now and then. Betts is the SS until he, or management decides he isn’t. If he moves anywhere, it will be to second base. Hell, if you want to move Betts, slide him over to second and put Edman at SS. Betts has 2 errors this year in 31 chances. The team as a whole has 7. Believe me, Mookie is not moving back to the outfield.