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Online Arguing: Just A Waste Of Time

Face it, we all do it. And it rarely changes the other guy’s stance. I know, I do it a lot. We all have differing opinions about anything and everything baseball. Politics is the same. Differing views depending on a ton of things.

I do know this to be a fact, the Dodgers are in the best stretch of winning in their entire baseball history. No Dodger decade is close except maybe the 50’s when they went to the World Series 5 times and won twice. They also finished in the top 3 eight of those 10 seasons. 57 and 58 are the only exceptions.

Since the last season that Colletti was the GM to now, they have finished in first in their division 9 of 10 times and second once. Three World Series and one win. They lost in the NLDS four times and the NLCS twice. But it is also much harder to make it to the World Series now.

The arguments can be over a myriad of subjects. Who they should trade for, good trades, bad trades. We all have an idea of what we consider the worst trades made by the Dodgers since they moved to LA. Few of us remember any trades Brooklyn made.

One I have had several times concerns who belongs in the Hall of Fame among Dodgers who are now retired. Many fans opine that Fernando belongs in the Hall. Almost all fans who believe that are Dodger fans. The impact Fernando made on Los Angeles is undeniable. He mesmerized LA fans like no player before or since.

He is the only player to ever win Rookie of the Year and the CyYoung in the same season. And his number was retired this year by the Dodgers, joining Jim Gilliam as the only non Hall members so honored.

But if you look solely at his stats, he is nowhere near being a Hall of Famer. Same argument can be made about Maury Wills. Wills brought the stolen base back as a weapon. He had a very good career. He won an MVP award and was a huge part of three World Champs.

But again, he did not have numbers comparable to his peers. But Maury has a good chance of getting in with the golden age committee. Valenzuela not so much. Garvey the same thing. He for his era did not possess the power of most first basemen of the time. Had he passed 300 homers, he might have been elected. In his 15 years on the ballot Garvey never got more than 42.6 percent of the vote. In his last year on the ballot only 21 percent.

Things like that can trigger a pretty passionate debate. I know, I have had them. But I also try to understand where the other person is coming from. A lot of them do not know how Hall of Famers are chosen. Or the criteria used by the BBWA.

My problem with arguments is that I have a trigger. Not the same thing all the time, but someone will post something, and I might have a strong opinion in the other direction. And then it is on.

Baseball fans are always going to argue. What matters is that you keep it civil and try to see the other person’s point of view.

 

08-02-2023 – MiLB Game Summary Report

 

OKC Dodgers 6 – Round Rock Express (Texas) 3

OKC scored 5 in the bottom of the 2nd inning to give OKC a 6-1 lead.  Mike Montgomery went 5 innings allowing only the one run, 3 hits, 2 BB, and 5 K for the win.

Jimmy Nelson’s LAD career seems to be coming to an end.  He allowed 2 runs on 3 hits, 1 BB in 0.2 IP.  His ERA is now at 7.71.  Gus Varland had another nice night in his one perfect inning with 2 Ks.

Michael Busch slugged his 19th HR, 4th in 5 games, 6 out of his last 9, and 12 since July 1.  And yet he cannot get a MLB job.

Key Performers:

  • Michael Busch – 2-5, 1 run, 2 RBI, HR (19)
  • Drew Avans – 2-5, 1 run, 1 RBI, double (21)
  • Ryan Ward – 1-4, 1 run, 2 RBI, HR (14)
  • David Dahl – double (16)

 

Box Score

 

Wichita Wind Surge (Minnesota) 4 – Tulsa Drillers 0

Wichita shutout the Drillers on 4 hits (3 singles and a double)

Key Performers:

  • José Ramos – 2-4, double (13)

 

Box Score

 

Great Lakes Loons 5 – Fort Wayne TinCaps (San Diego) 2

The Loons slugged 3 solo HRs, including 2 in the 7th when they scored 3 runs to open up a 4-1 lead.

Ronan Kopp started and did complete 3.0 hitless and scoreless innings.  He did issue 4 walks against 2 Ks.  Michael Hobbs finished the final 2.0 scoreless innings, on 1 hit, with 3 Ks.

Key Performers:

  • HR – Taylor Young (4), Alex Freeland (7), and Griffin Lockwood-Powell (9)

 

Box Score

 

Fresno Grizzlies (Colorado) 7 – Rancho Cucamonga Quakes 2

Fresno jumped out to a 6-0 lead after 3.2 innings.  RC scored 2 in the 7th after being down 7-0.  RC had a total of 4 hits (all singles).

Key Performers:

  • Wilman Diaz – 2-3, 1 run

 

Box Score

 

 

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Dionysus

It must be exhausting always rooting for the anti-hero.

Jeff Dominique

I appreciate this site because MOST of the time, commenters seem to be respectable even when they do not agree with a point made. When one decides to name call or belittle someone, the argument is lost. I think Bear is right, in most discussions, minds are not going to be changed. Although I have had my mind changed on a few occasions. I like it when points and counterpoints are made, but are not made with rancor .

However, over time, I do believe that Bear has changed his mind a bit about AF, but not about Tyler White and Jedd Gyorko.

Scott Andes

You’ve done a fine job with this site Jeff. Its a nice place to talk Dodgers. People can come here express their opinions without fear of being called morons or idiots and being run off the boards.

Also your articles are well written and informative without bombarding us with boring advanced analytics or excessive Friedman butt-kissing. You’re able to fairly praise Friedman for the good things he does while still criticizing his mistakes and faults.

Bear’s articles are always well written and thoughtful as well. I’ve written thousands of articles during my time as a Dodger writer, sat in the press box, interviewed players, and met Dodger legends but the most satisfying accomplishment has always been being the host of a community. At least for me. I enjoyed it, it was something I always wanted to do and I am so glad I got the opportunity to do it. During the hey days of Ladodgerreport and the hundreds of comments On the site every day, people argued alot and it became tough to moderate the arguments. I hope that doesn’t happen over here but I have no doubt you have the tools and the temperament to deal with it appropriately. I was probably a little too hands off in my approach.

I’m happy to be a part of this community, you’re a good man Jeff and so is Bear. Keep up the great work. Its not easy hosting a community. It takes a lot of hard work, dedication and patience. You guys are doing a fine job.

Now if only I can convince Jeff that Rojas sucks…..lol JK. (whispers…he really does stink)

Jeff Dominique

Thank you, Scott.

Oldbear48

Yes, the meter has moved off of yikes to well that makes sense. And I still think both of those trades were horrendous.

Badger

We debate. I see no arguments here.

Jeff you made a point about Lynn’s 7 innings that was immediately supported by Gonsolin’s 5. The A’s appear to be a pathetic Major League Baseball team, but they are Major League players. Why did it take him 84 pitches to get through 5, and why can’t he throw 90 and get through 6 against a lineup like that? Because he’s Gonsolin, that’s why. The question I have is can he make it through to November.

The offense looks fine. They will have their off nights against better pitching, but I still see issues with our own better pitching. I’m not convinced we have it.

Singing the Blue

When we watch Gonsolin this year I think we sometimes forget how truly special he was last year.

Was that just luck or is the difference due to an injury or flawed mechanics? I sure as hell don’t know, and apparently the team gurus don’t either because it hasn’t been corrected.

At his best, he can carry the rotation but what we’re seeing this year leads to lots of frustration, and I’m sure for him as well.

He’s been consistently inconsistent this year and that’s the last thing you want to deal with on a pitching staff.

Bobby

Correction: Fernando jersey hasn’t been retired YET; his special weekend is next weekend, Aug 11-12 vs the Rockies.

Oldbear48

Semantics. We all know it is happening.

Badger

MLB Power Rankings (BR)

1. Atlanta Braves
2. Baltimore Orioles
3. Texas Rangers
4. Tampa Bay Rays
5. Houston Astros
6. Los Angeles Dodgers
7. Philadelphia Phillies
8. Toronto Blue Jays
9. Milwaukee Brewers
10. San Francisco Giants
11. Cincinnati Reds
12. Boston Red Sox
13. Los Angeles Angels
14. Chicago Cubs
15. Minnesota Twins
16. Arizona Diamondbacks
17. San Diego Padres
18. New York Yankees
19. Miami Marlins
20. Seattle Mariners
21. Cleveland Guardians
22. Detroit Tigers
23. New York Mets
24. Washington Nationals
25. Pittsburgh Pirates
26. St. Louis Cardinals
27. Colorado Rockies
28. Chicago White Sox
29. Kansas City Royals
30. Oakland Athletics

No arguments from me.

Dylan Hernandez came out pretty hard on Friedman this morning. This isn’t a World Series team, Friedman knows it, and didn’t really work that hard to do anything about it. And you already know Plaschke agrees. Comments?

Oldbear48

Don’t live in Cali and don’t get those columns online since ya gotta pay for them. Did not read either of them.

Bumsrap

Nor was the 88 Dodgers supposed to be so there is hope. Wildcard teams have won the Championship. The Dodgers certainly are not the favorites as a #6 power ranking suggests.

Singing the Blue

Never been a fan of Plaschke or Hernandez. Probably just my take on things, but I think 90% of what they write is negative. Think of what their columns would look like if we weren’t winning most of the time.

Give me Bill Shaikin any day. In my view, he writes honestly, positive or negative whatever the case calls for, and doesn’t try to make himself the focus of the story.

Jeff Dominique

Now that I agree with 100%. Both Plaschke and Hernández are good writers. I would never say otherwise. I do not believe they are true journalists like Shaikin. They are gifted opinion writers, that love to stir the pot. I only read them when somebody brings up an article they have written, that they either agree with or disagree with. As STB says, they are both generally negative, especially Hernández. I do not like Plaschke because of his absolute disdain for USC. Contrary to some, it is not because Hernández is a Bruin that I do not like him.

Bill Shaikin is by far the best journalist in the LA Times Sports (IMO).

Fred Vogel

Don’t tell me that you just gave me a reason to like Plaschke 😀

Scott Andes

Shaikin is more of a beat reporter. He just reports and distributes news. Plaschke and Hernandez are opinion Journalists and damn good ones. The LA Times is the best of the best. The reason I like the LA Times so much is that they don’t mince words. They call it like it is and don’t blow smoke up people’s butts. That’s what Journalism is all about in my opinion. If every writer only regurgiated the news, or wrote about how everything is so great, that would not only be boring but a disservice to everyone reading.

Journalism is all about uncovering and reporting the truth. Because life is not just roses and sunshine all the time. It’s black and white. So are the Dodgers. The Dodgers have faults, and sometimes they make mistakes, and sometimes they do great things and are awesome. Both sides need to be properly reported.

Badger

Could not have said it better myself Scott.

Plaschke has won the AP Sports Columnist of the Year four times for good reason. He certainly knows how to touch nerves, and the reason he can is because he tells it like he sees it. The other writers there are closer to it all than I am and I appreciate their access.

Jeff Dominique

Nobody is saying he is a not a good writer. You said it:

because he tells it like he sees it”

Agreed. He is a talented writer with opinions. That does not make him a journalist. Shaikin is a journalist.

Scott Andes

Toribio is fairly new. Not saying Shaikin isn’t good at what he does. He’s very good. But the Times, and all of us need writers like Plaschke and Hernandez.

I never met Plaschke, but met Hernandez several times during my trips to the press box. He’s a super nice guy. I did see Shaikin there often, but never said a word to him.

Badger

“That does not make him a journalist.”

By definition of journalism it certainly does.

They all practice journalism. It appears to me you don’t like him because of an SC bias.

Jeff Dominique

I do have comments that I am working on.

More to come…

Hondo

Dodgers still haven’t won a full season WS since 1988. They only have a Covid ring for 60 games. Not much more than a third of a season. Definitely not satisfying.
The Times articles were right on the mark and I agree.
Kasten and Friedman’s goal is just enough to make us contenders — not the WS. They know they can continually get away it.

Bumsrap

The Dodgers were a top ranked team when they won the short season Championship. It’s not like their win was a fluke. They still had to get through the playoff gauntlet.

This season could fade away but if it doesn’t then I will enjoy watching the young players more than I would enjoy winning with the addition of a few rentals.

Last edited 8 months ago by Bumsrap
Badger

Watching young Dodger players was more exciting when they were guys like Kershaw, Seager, Bellinger, Buehler, May, Urias, Lux, Smith etc. The few we have brought up this year don’t look much like those guys. Not to say they won’t be, but it doesn’t look like it will be this year.

Obviously there are many quality players in the pipeline. Are any of them potential perennial All Stars? Yeah. Sure. Maybe.

Bumsrap

Miller and Sheehan could be Aces soon enough IMHO. I love Outman.

Stone barged into my head and I don’t want him to slip out as quickly as he got in. I have hopes for him. I root for Grove and believe he is better than his stats would indicate. Somebody has to be #5 in a rotation. Pepiot might be a little better than Grove. He had misfortune this year.

I want to see how Miller, Sheehan, Stone, Grove, Pepiot, Buehler, and Grove finish the year. Kershaw, Urias, and Gonsolin most likely won’t be back next year with Gonsolin getting traded in the off season.

I want another young position player to root for. I don’t think Vargas, Busch, Pages, DeLuca will be the ones that capture my captivation.

Jeff Dominique

Why don’t you think Vargas, Busch, Deluca or Pages will capture your captivation? I like Busch most out of all that group. He would be in MLB if he was on almost any other of the 29 teams.

While I do think that Gonsolin is a prime candidate to be traded from LAD, I am not sure he has enough value to get much in return, unless packaged with others.

Bumsrap

I’m hoping Vargas becomes part of a package for a young player who excels on both defense and offense. I want Betts and Lux in the infield.

I want Busch to be more than a DH because of his youth and he has a better chance to do that on another team.

It’s difficult for me to get excited about a player if I think he would be traded.

If DeLuca hit 300 I would quickly add him to those that captivate me. I love watching him on defense.

Singing the Blue

Would you settle for .290?

Bumsrap

.280 would get it done. Put him at third and I would be even more into him. It would seem like having Cey back.

Dionysus

Congrats on this take.

Jeff Dominique

60 game season and that playoff gauntlet was fine with me. No asterisk for me. Those that want to put an asterisk are mostly fans of teams in the other cities that did not win it, but would have accepted it had they won it. Or fans that just do not like these Dodgers.

It was a World Series Championship, more so than the one that Houston says they deserve in 2017 after cheating. Take away the 2017 WS Championship from Houston, then come back and talk about as asterisk.

Dionysus

Bingo

Oldbear48

The Dodgers, Yankees and the Astros are three of the most disliked franchises in pro sports. Why? Because they win. Astros for the cheating scandal. People hate that the Dodgers have the wherewithal to reload and sign big stars. Teams who trade with the Dodgers want the highest return because of the farm system. We do not know who was in the deal for Rodriguez. But you can bet at least one of LA’s top prospects was part of the trade. Gomes danced around the question last night when it was posed by Nelson.

Jeff Dominique

Unfortunately I have to listen to the A’s announcers in NorCal. MLB is blocked out in NorCal for the Dodgers when they play SF or Oakland. I have to give them credit to try and make games interesting that the A’s are a part of.

Bumsrap

Maybe teams think the Dodgers would be smarter than other teams.

Bluto

Is this even possible in theory or reality, given how much luck and variance are involved:

Kasten and Friedman’s goal is just enough to make us contenders — not the WS.

Badger

Making it to the tournament is the only realistic goal any team can strive for because of the reasons you just gave Bluto – luck and variance. Winning the Division isn’t a matter of luck, though losing it could be. That said, anytime you can increase your chances at success two months down the road I think all fans would say go for it. And the team with the highest winning percentage the last several years, the Dodgers, have done just that a few years running. How’d it work out? We got one.

This year it sure looks to me like Houston did the most to increase their odds. Atlanta is the team to beat in the NL. If we’re lucky, we might get the chance to beat them both come October.

OhioDodger

You can’t be serious. Geez.

Scott Andes

Oh brother….Not the “it’s all luck/crapshoot argument”

(Facepalm)

OhioDodger

I saw where Hondo posted a not so nice post about Timmons on LADT and they deleted it.

Scott Andes

lolz, what did he say? Mark probably deleted it himself

OhioDodger

I think Bear deleted it.

Singing the Blue

I’m drafting a letter to ERod to thank him for squashing the trade. I have a hunch this would have come in second behind the Bauer deal as AF’s biggest mistake.

He left the Red Sox last year to handle personal problems (I have no problem with that) but never contacted the team to let them know how he was doing. They were just left there wondering if/when he was ever going to come back.

A number of his former teammates who now play for us texted him when it looked as though we might make a play for him. These guys thought they were friends with him, not just ex-teammates, yet he never took the trouble to answer them.

Now I read that when the deal was in the works he told the Dodgers he wanted to add another year at 20 mil if he didn’t opt out. He was certainly entitled to ask for that. He was in a good position to bargain. But only after AF said no did he enforce his no-trade provision. I don’t have a problem with that either, but then his people made it sound like it was all family reasons that he didn’t come.

Friedman and Gomes have gone out of their way to blend a very close clubhouse this year. Most guys on the team say this is the best group they’ve had here. I think Rodriguez simply would not have fit in the way that the front office wanted.

Bobby

Agree with you. He’s no “hero family man.”

OhioDodger

I agree. This guy is a head case with baggage we didn’t need. I don’t know what we were giving up to get him, but, if it was one or two of our top prospects, he did us a favor. I still can’t believe the Tigers could not work out a deal with one of the teams not on his no trade list. I thought Miami was looking for pitching. Detroit screwed the pooch.

Bumsrap

Although Bauer was said to fit into the clubhouse, F&G certainly were willing to bend instead of blend regarding Bauer.

OhioDodger

Darn good trade for Rosario. Essentially got Amed for nothing. Syndergaard was a total flop. Rosario has already done more for the Dodgers than Thor did.

He is actually having a better year than Trea Turner.

Turner: 443AB, .662 OPS, 10 HR, 34 RBI, .237 BA, 81 OPS+.

Rosario: 398 AB, .689 OPS, 4HR, 43 RBI, .269 BA, 92 OPS+.

Dionysus

I like him.

OhioDodger

And, he hits lefties much better.

Turner vs LHP: 138 PA, .700 OPS, 89 OPS+.
Rosario vs LHP: 125 PA, .844 OPS, 127 OPS+.

Bumsrap

And he is almost as fast, maybe.

He is playing second and has never done that. Maybe he should platoon with Muncy at third. He has a lot of left side experience.

Last edited 8 months ago by Bumsrap
Bluto

The Good
Aldry Acosta was getting 18 inches of horizonal movement on his sinker, which, paired with 94 on the Velo, is very tough to hit. He also has good deception and throws to the corners. Put that all together & that’s is why he’s so good at missing barrels.

The Not so Good
Tough start tonight for #Dodgers No. 13 prospect Maddux Bruns

Although he struck out 7 in 4.1 IP, Bruns allowed two homers and five earned runs in total. It was the first time Bruns has allowed multiple homers in a start in his entire pro career

The Excellent:
Nick Frasso was EXCELLENT tonight for Double-A Tulsa

5.0 IP
3 H
0 R
1 BB
8 K
19 whiffs (!!!)
77 P / 53 S

Last edited 8 months ago by Bluto
Jeff Dominique

Damn that Rojas!!😍

Scott Andes

Lolz he’s having the game of his life. Heard he had trouble getting into his mansion the other day. Apparently someone put a home plate in front of it…..hiyoooooo

Drops mic, crowd goes wild

Dionysus

Barnes is God

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